There's been a few things going on over on the CAMRA forums, that I've decided to keep out of and not get involved in, but one particular discussion I've been following with interest has been regarding the AGMs.
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| The process to submit a motion |
I haven't been to one, read about one or chatted to anyone about one, so I have no idea what goes on. From what I can gather from What's Boring, it seems that after a complex procedure to submit a motion, nothing much happens. This, to be fair, could because the communication from HQ is poor. One of the points made in the fit for purpose review.
Back to the forum, what did interest me was the suggestion that the AGM could be recorded, or even better involve web-conferencing. This would be ideal for me, as I don't have the time or money to travel to any AGM (I doubt I'll be able to make any more GBBFs for that matter as well).
The chairman, Colin Valentine, graced the forum with his presence and had the following response to this suggestion:
{extract}Anyway, back to the thread. Personally, I am totally against webconferencing although, as I said to conference in Sheffield, it is conference's decision and the only way to influence conference is to actually go there.
Just because someone is pathetic or dishonest enough to record parts of my address to conference (see you tube, search my name and join the other 845 views, 6 comments who watched 2 minutes 47 seconds of my (almost interminable) 16 minute speech) does not mean that we should record it and post it on the website.Colin{/extract}
Now this grabbed by goat - I've read it back a few times and mulled over it for a couple of hours and still stand by my interpretation:
I'm not allowed to influence conference, specifically regarding access to it, because I can't make it to conference.
It's the final straw for CAMRA and I, so I'll be trying to get a refund on the remainder of my membership fee. The NE appear to be stuck in their own world, full of hypocrisy (during his speech Colin refers to the 'blogerati' in a derogatory way, yet admits in his speech he only reads Tandleman's) and poor communication. In this day and age, with blogs, tweets, emails, websites etc, there is no excuse for poor communication.
In the example above, be against web conferencing by all means, but at least have the decency to explain why!
In the example above, be against web conferencing by all means, but at least have the decency to explain why!
In my view this further demonstrates that CAMRA is stuck in it's ways and the NE won't change. As I still feel with trade bodies, organisations that claim to represent their members should make it as easy as possible for their members to get their views across.
I'm not going to do a Brewdog and not sell any real ale in the pub - that would just be daft. But I doubt CAMRA will be around much longer - not because of 'craft beer', but because real ale has been saved - almost too much. There are beers and breweries out there that I won't put on the bar due to their quality and their attitude to the pub when quality issues are raised. There are a lot of good keg beers now that are far superior to these ales.
I also certainly know of at least one large beer festival that will be showcasing amazing beers, be they cask or keg, coming up this year.
Sound the bells, Cask has been saved.
Oh, I think CAMRA will still be around, but it will increasingly become a beer drinkers' club that organises beer festivals, not a campaigning organisation in any meaningful sense. It has certainly failed to come up with a coherent response to the changes in the pub trade and brewing industry over the past few years.
ReplyDeleteThat may well be the case, but they should make it clear that they are nothing more.
ReplyDeleteCAMRA will be alive and kicking for a good many years to come yet, I think you can be sure of that.
ReplyDeleteAs for Colin's comments re webconferencing, I know some of his reasoning, but it wouldn't be appropriate for me to channel him here - he's quite big enough to speak for himself, and, do you know, if you email him with a polite, civil enquiry, rather than simply berating him from behind your keyboard, he'll probably explain that reasoning to you, too. (His email address should be available from the CAMRA website, should you want it, although I somehow doubt that you will).
From my own perspective, live-links from AGM would be expensive to set up, and I'm none too certain that is a good use of the Campaign's money. Annoyingly AGM has clashed with our holiday the last several years - and will do so again this year, so we have been unable to attend. As for having input without attending, should you wish to vote on appointments to the NE you can do this by using a postal vote - details in What's Brewing. It's impractical to enable people to vote on motions remotely, as they would be doing so without having seen any of the debate on the subject - or, in other words, without relevant information.
One thing is for sure - the ONLY way of influencing CAMRA policy is to be part of the organisation.
Robyn, I'm genuinely convinced camra will, within the next few years, be little more than a fan club for ale.
ReplyDeleteAs for Colin, I posted on the 2nd of Jan, he posted on the third (not in response) and has not responded since. The camra forums were a fantastic chance for NE to communicate with members, which has not been taken up.
I'd ask one thing of camra - to create a survey sent out to ALL members enquiring what direction they should go. Then they can be called a members organisation, and I'd feel I have an input
Ed
Your last paragraph is very fair - and I assume that you do in fact intend to write to HQ with this request?
ReplyDeleteI'm sure the forums may well have been intended as a good way for the NE to communicate with the members, but I'm unsure whether this idea was run by the NE members before launching! Some people are comfortable using internet forums, some simply aren't, and it should not be forgotten that the NE members are all volunteers, just the same as any other CAMRA member
who takes an active role in the campaign. I still maintain that should you choose to contact Colin directly on the subject, he will almost certainly be happy to respond on a one-to-one basis.
Thanks for your considered and reasoned response on the subject - that is appreciated!
Robyn
I certainly plan to email hq to ask about the survey idea, I'm currently waiting for a new RD for wales to be elected on the basis that might prove a better channel.
ReplyDeleteAs for the style of response, it's just common manners - mindless ranting doesn't get anyone anywhere. And I always prefer a good debate to a bad argument :)
As the author of the post about web conferencing, I was pretty sad to read Colin's reply. I often feel like I'm banging my head against a wall when making suggestions that may improve CAMRA engagement with the people who can't make physical meetings. Told I come across as too arrogant or a smart arse. Ho hum. But this year's conference was audio recorded and it might be made available to members so a small step in the right direction
ReplyDelete